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[ajohnamous]

It seems that if Israel were dissolved a lot of terrorists would lose their motivation for committing crimes. This is not my main argument for dissolving Israel but it is a bonus.  
I support a Jewish population in Palestine but I do not believe this population must be of a Jewish state.

edit: some bastard reworded the poll, what a bastard that person is.

edit: realized that I shouldn't call a moderator a bastard, but please don't reword a poll to make my attitude seem egregiously racist and insensitive. Post below if you have an opinion to make, but don't voice it through me.

[Maximumbeing]

What do you mean by, 'dissolve'? And more importantly, how do you pan on dissolving a nation that doesn't want to be dissolved?

[xbox beat box]

Fuck Israel

[melon]

agreed Fuck Israel!!!!

I wouldnt care if everyone of them was killed. They obviously dont care about Palastinians.

[gronne]

QUOTE (xbox beat box @ Oct 14 2004, 07:34 PM)

Fuck Israel

I would have to second that. No, but seriously they should go back to the borders of 1967. And then Palestine should admit them as a legal state. Now I doubt they will do it even then, but I don't think you can come more near of a peace than that, unless you don't throw out the jews. But that shall definitely not happen. The jews should IMMEDIATELY stop occupying Palestine.

There is a lot of anti-semitism, but there's probably even more anti-islam in the world. Why should I care more for the jews than the muslims? Muslims aren't occupying anybody. It's american nonsense to support Israel. It's not strange they attacked you in 9/11 when you support Israel. How can you be that naive?

[melon]

Over the last two weeks the Israeli army has killed 115 Palistinians and injured more than 350. This is actually in Palastine. How is this protection from suicide bombers?

Explain that to the family of Iman al Hasan, she was walking to school when she was shot 20 times. There was another girl who was killed by a bullet as she sat at her desk in class. How is this protection from suicide bombers?

I wont even start on the "peace" wall!

Our Foriegn secertary today condemmed Israel saying they are breaking international law.


For all you selfish people too self obsessed with your own world to care about anyone else think about this..
Billions yes Billions of the money you pay in tax goes to Israel every year.  Quite a lot for an affluent country.
That money could be used in the US to increase peoples access to medical help or to imporve standards in schools.
For every billion that goes to Israel you could employ 20,000 more police officers (assuming they earn $50k a year???).
It could ease some of that defecit the government is running in or be used to cut taxes or help small business' grow.
So why does your country give so much money to Israel???

And more importantly why the fuck does it continuely use its veto in the UN to stop every single motion that wants to act against Israel???

And you complained about France threatening to use its veto...

[gronne]

QUOTE (johnnobts @ Oct 14 2004, 10:52 PM)

trust me, anti-semitism is much stronger than anti-islamic sentiments in the world.  this is b/c there are over a bililon muslims today, and islam, unfortunatley, is the fastest growing religion in the world.   israel will continue to receive our support for three main reasons: (1) religious ties to the U.S.  Jews lobby for Israel here in America, a country steeped in Judeo-Christian values, not Islamic Extremism... (2) Israel is a democracy.  last time i checked, we supported democracies (3) Israel is the 5th largest military power in the world, and we need their expertise, their experience, and their resources in the global war on terrorism. -get rid of that camel jockey arafat and lets actually get a timetable going towards creating a palestinian nation...  that's the problem: no real leadership among the palestinians.  to you who think israel should be "dissovled," two words for you: "heil hitler..."  nazis... by the way, i'm no crazy zionist or anything, i'm just pointing out reasons why israel deserves our support....

I will answer your little numbers.

1. You support them for religious reasons. That's very true, but does it legitimize anything? SICK reason.

2. A democracy??? For a starter, USA is NOT a democracy, and nations like Israel OCCUPYING others, are NOT democracies. You can't support a democracy if you are not one yourself. How democratic are you if you occupy someone?

3. Since when the fuck did USA listen to anybody else? And do you think they are successful in "fighting" terrorism? Maybe they should fight themselves, real terrorists. Calling me a nazi? You are incredibly much more prejudice than I am, Mr. I hate muslims.

How would you feel if Schwarzenegger decided California to be a part of Austria? Would you not attack him if he occupied a part of USA? You can't steal a nation and claim you have the right to defend something that was never yours.

People should start using their brains for once.

[sgcgirl52]

okay first of all how dare you say that if you "disslove" Isreal that Terroist will lose their motavationas and go away.  That is like saying to get Terroist to stop hating Americans so much we should dissolve america.  Seriously people.  And don't listen to CNN and all that for Isreal reports.  tHey slant so much to the palestinans that I thkink they might actually be run by one.  Also, I would like to see any army, Air force, ect, try and disslove Isreal.  Do you know the history of the country. How they won their independnce and faught, and died and won when all of their neighboors attacked them simatanously?  Do you?  I mean the saying is right,  "If Isreal found a cure for cancer, they would be criticized for the abuse of the animals they tested on."  Isreal does nothing but try and be a country that is constantly having terrioist attack them.  They have Oklahoma City Bombing sized things every day EVERY DAY!!!!  

Other facts on Isreal.  In the beginging of te first Iraqi war, th Isreali Air Force flew to Iraq undetected, bombed Hussain's almost finished nuclear reactor (add teh U 235 and it was finished basically) and flew back to Isreal without any one knowing.  If they hadn't told the US about it, no one would have known.  Htey were critized for doing what everyone else wanted to do.   Also with their AF, they had a war game a few years ago with Germany.  Every single German plan was shot down.  Not a single hit was made on the Isrealis.  sO please tell me how could you do this  "dissolving", Isreals no sugar in a cup of water.

Another thing, more of a joke really but it makes a point.  

-"A rabbi was telling the story of how Moses came into Isreal to a a group of students and some palastinans includeing Arafat.  The Rabbi explained the before Moses went into Isreal he took a bath at a lake.  He folded his clothes and left them on a rock.  In the middle of his bath a Palestinian came and stol his clothes, leaving Moses without a stuch to wear.  
Enraged by this story, Arafat stood up and said, "Excuse me, but I'll have you know that there were no Palestinians here at that time."
The Rabbi then replied, "My point exactly" (Othe wersions have him going Ahcha but I can't relally speel that out as it sounds so...)
*note as well.  yes I know that Moses never entered Isreal because he wasn't allowed but its a joke okay?*

I really can't understand why anyone would think of getting rid of Isreal in place of the terrioist that many Palestinains have become/support.

~*~Temma~*~

[Maximumbeing]

Israel has one of the most defined militaries in the world (thanks to Starbucks), but they are not industrially stable enough to support themselves, and if sanctioned, would not be able to hold up its war machine.


Israel is fueled by the blood of innocence.

Give Palestine a home!

[dss311]

This thread is fucking a joke.  Get rid of Israel?   LOL ...What next Canada???  Both peoples (Israel/Palestine) deserve to live in peace without fear from opposing nations and terrorist.  It is a shame their views are in such conflict with each other that they cannot get along.  This is part of what makes the US great.  We tolerate each other even though some views directly clash with our own core beliefs.  I hope a territory is set aside for the Palestine people but right now I don't see where they will get the land.  Nobody wants to give up their territory, and Israel was given their land by the UN.  One could argue about the west bank and land the Palestine lost in their conflicts but I do not think it Israel owes anyone anything.  That would be like Mexico asking the US for Texas back.  It just isn't going to happen.  They lost Texas in the Alamo battle and to the victor comes the spoils.  Hopefully someday their is peace in the region but I do not see it happening for many decades.....


DSS311

[Morglum]

QUOTE (melon @ Oct 14 2004, 08:31 PM)

agreed Fuck Israel!!!! I wouldnt care if everyone of them was killed. They obviously dont care about Palastinians.

Agree with you 100%!!!

[melon]

QUOTE

anti-semitism is at an all-time high in the mid-east and in europe

Are the Jews special?
A lot of people hate Israel for there treatment of the Palastinians just like a lot of people hate the US for its foriegn policy.

Why when a person hates Israel does it have to turn into a religious issue?
A lot of people around the world dont like the way Israel ats in the West bank and the Gaza strip (now the largest prison on earth), in fact as already mentioned many times the UN has tried to pass motions condemming Israel or threatning sanctions. Unfortunetly the US as a permanent security council member uses its veto every time.
It is not anti-semetism it is a hatred of its oppressive actions towards Palastine.

QUOTE

trust me, anti-semitism is much stronger than anti-islamic sentiments in the world. this is b/c there are over a bililon muslims today, and islam, unfortunatley, is the fastest growing religion in the world.

Muslims hate Israel for many justified reasons although not neccesary Israels fault.
You blatantly show racism here.

QUOTE

(1) religious ties to the U.S. Jews lobby for Israel here in America, a country steeped in Judeo-Christian values, not Islamic Extremism...

Not every muslim is an extremist, this is a rasist generalisation of the masses based on an the actions of an extremely severe minority. Its like saying every Irishman is as extreme as the IRA!
Religion is no reason to support a country's terrible actions. It is one of the reasons there is hatred for America in the middle east.  You support Israel when they are the aggressors.

QUOTE

(2) Israel is a democracy. last time i checked, we supported democracies

Where a democracy as well, can we have 8billion dollars a year?

QUOTE

(3) Israel is the 5th largest military power in the world, and we need their expertise, their experience, and their resources in the global war on terrorism.

You will find that Israel is reliant on the US for military equipment. They are playing no part in Iraq and dint play any part in Afghanastan. Why are they needed exactly?

QUOTE

-get rid of that camel jockey arafat

RACIST LANGUAGE

[melon]

QUOTE

Do you know the history of the country. How they won their independnce and faught, and died and won when all of their neighboors attacked them simatanously? Do you?

You prove you dont.
Israel was created after WWII it was actually the UK who had to decide what to do. WE decided to take some land from a few middle east countries and give it to Israel in 1948. I can understand the countries who have just had there land taken from then being pissed off. I can also understand the Israeli view of having a permanent home somewhere in the world, especially against the backdrop of WWII and the suffering they endured.
I can understand the surrounding countries wanting there land back. Imagine Bush taking huge chunks of land from your state, including your entire neighbourhood, and giving it the indiginous Indian Americans. You would go mental.
As for the actual war, Israel was made up of educated American and Europeans. They had our technology and military equipment. A lot came who were military trained, almost every capable man because of WWII. They easily beat the poorly equiped armies they faced.

QUOTE

They have Oklahoma City Bombing sized things every day EVERY DAY!!!!

You can just make up shit. that is completely untrue.
168 people died that day in the Oklahoma bomb.
So what your saying is every day Palastine kills that many Israeli's?
In there suicide attacks it averages about 2 or 3 deaths. I am not making light of this, a detah is a death, its wrong!
But to compare the 2 is highly illogical and incorrect.
A more favourable comparison would be Israel's attacks on Palastine which always result in a much higher death count than the Palastinian attack they are retaliating against.

QUOTE

Also with their AF, they had a war game a few years ago with Germany. Every single German plan was shot down. Not a single hit was made on the Isrealis. sO please tell me how could you do this "dissolving", Isreals no sugar in a cup of water.

And us British summoned dragons (what do you think stonehenge is for?) and they shielded our spitfires by eating any bullet fired and flames burst from there mouths and descimated every enemy plane..

[rocky_2197]

Back to the topic should Israel be dissolved as stated.  No.  Should there be a reformation of the boarders yes.  Israel is an alley, they were asked by Bush not to get envolved with either wars because the US doesn't want to make it appear as a war against Islam, witch it isn't.  They have contributed greatly to our US military through cross training (wich I have been part of several times). Not only do they have the 5 largest military in the world but the 2-3 most elite military US being #1)  Israel contibutes greatly to the world but that is never seen by the anti-sematics of the world.  Also Palestenians also would be productive to the world if given the chance.  

Like I said befor two countries need to be created, with new govenments enpower.
And once Sherron and Arafat are dead or completly out of power it might happen.

P.s. sorry if this doesn't make sense it's late and I am out of coffee.

[BenJeremy]

Poll edited to reflect the tone of the anti-Israeli posters in this thread.

Sad.

It's clear we've learned nothing from Hitler and Stalin's actions, nor the centuries of persecution of people because of their religion. People see Israel as a Jewish land, but it is actually populated by people of all religions, races and creeds, and the most tolerant country in the entire Middle East. That is something people, particularly PEACE-LOVING people should encourage, not hate.