xboxscene.org forums

Pages: 1 [2]

Author Topic: Microsoft: PS3 Linux Not Competitive Compared To XNA  (Read 719 times)

dvsone

  • Archived User
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 328
Microsoft: PS3 Linux Not Competitive Compared To XNA
« Reply #15 on: December 14, 2006, 07:46:00 PM »

Are any of you critics game developers?

If i was a game developer, i would be having wet dreams about this stuff! I can turn my 360 into a mini dev kit and share my games with the 360 community! Wake up fools, this rools! Anyone that is serious about game development will love this and i expect a good response from it. Anyone this criticizes this i have no respect for. This will improve the industry greatly and open doors for talented young developers. XNA is for game developers not the gamers, but it will benefit us all in the end.
Logged

Altima NEO

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 606
Microsoft: PS3 Linux Not Competitive Compared To XNA
« Reply #16 on: December 14, 2006, 08:47:00 PM »

Didint they already use PS3 linux to dump a disc image?
Logged

122275

  • Archived User
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 5
Microsoft: PS3 Linux Not Competitive Compared To XNA
« Reply #17 on: December 14, 2006, 10:24:00 PM »

Well all I can tell you is what I know nothing more.

I download the visual c# express and the game studio but  ( did not purchase the creators club for ms).
I am able to build games and applications and many other things. What I have learned so for is I can play anything I make, game or app for windows directly from within Visual C# express or build an exe to transfer to any computer to be played and with a xbox 360 controller. Whats good about this is any XNA game/app made for windows is easy to convert to the xbox 360 format from within the game editior.  Visual C# express and tha Game Studio are free to download and register.     So what I'm saying is you can build the homebrew for free and pass it to friends to play on there computer with a xbox 360 controller but if you want to play it on you xbox 360 you will have to buy the Creators Club  but you have the chance to decide if you can program good enough to make it worth you paying ms for the 360 access.

If you like to play with building your on games like I do, this is the next best thing to sliced bread.
and its free      (till you want to transfer to the xbox360)

As far as them being able to dump the ps3 disc huh  they have been doing the 360 for a year now and they have dumped the hd dvd aswell so that really means nothing to me (except for some texture and 3d models
maybe Ill make a Halo homegrew game with instead of Masterchief it will be Fenix from Gears of War fightin in a Splinter Cell level.  LOL

PS I was thinking if I could get the game to save to a memory card like with a action replay then I might not need the Creators Club or maybe a usb thumb drive might work .    The PS is just a thought not fact.
 
I can build my games and play them too
or was that have my cake and eat it too

Just my humble 2 cents
Logged

The Zep Man

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 888
Microsoft: PS3 Linux Not Competitive Compared To XNA
« Reply #18 on: December 15, 2006, 01:44:00 AM »

Let me see...

In one hand, we have the Xbox 360 which, with a yearly fee, can play 'homebrew' C# code without network functionality but with 3D acceleration. Mostly made for games.

On the other hand, we have the PS3 which, without a yearly fee, can run Linux and any compilable code with it without 3D acceleration but with network support. Mostly made for homebrew applications.

For the 'official homebrew'-part my vote goes to the PS3, even though I will likely never buy one. Both consoles are sandboxed, but one costs money and is very limited while the other is 'free' after the purchase of the console and is less limited. The performance issues with the PS3 version of Linux will probably fade away in the future, when the kernel is more optimized.

The reason I will not buy a PS3? Because I want to see Linux working on the Xbox 360. I'm saving my money for that.
Logged

EugeneEW3RD

  • Archived User
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 30
Microsoft: PS3 Linux Not Competitive Compared To XNA
« Reply #19 on: December 15, 2006, 04:09:00 PM »

Well, this is a tough choice but I'll go with XNA for 360, yes you do have to pay $100 a year to make your creations run on 360 but you have access to 3D acceleration so you can make both 2D & 3D games but you can't access the network ports.

The PS3 has Linux for homberew & while you can program on their version of Linux for free & have access to network ports, you don't have access to 3D acceleration so 3D game will run slowly since you don't have access to the acceleration but you do have access to the network ports.

Also, MS mentioned that they might be looking at ways to allow people to play XNA games without needing the subscription to XNA creators club.
Logged

Altima NEO

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 606
Microsoft: PS3 Linux Not Competitive Compared To XNA
« Reply #20 on: December 15, 2006, 07:05:00 PM »

Really whats the point of "Homebrew" on the PS3 if you cannot do 3D? That to me sounds like the only reason to make a game for it, to acces that beefy graphics chip and make it your bitch. I mean big whoop, you can make some flash games and some crappy Doom ports. You can do a whole lot better on the old Xbox, or even PSP.
So much like Sony's online system, you get what you pay for with homebrew on the PS3 (ie. free).
Logged

MetalMickey

  • Archived User
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 16
Microsoft: PS3 Linux Not Competitive Compared To XNA
« Reply #21 on: December 16, 2006, 04:24:00 AM »

Who the hell cares about 3D? I want applications like XBMC, not crappy home-made games.
Logged

openxdkman

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 550
Microsoft: PS3 Linux Not Competitive Compared To XNA
« Reply #22 on: December 16, 2006, 07:35:00 AM »

I try to get clear ideas after reading all arguments posted so far in various forums...

What is interesting is to obtain a very large base of identical hardware that can be targetted by a developper who wants to make the effort to optimize his code in order to produce something great (if the number of potential users is low, it's not really worth the effort).

This optimization will be really great if it's done in order to take full advantage of a 'beast'. Recent GPUs (xbox360, ps3, ATI, NVidia) are pure 'beasts'.

In XNA forum it is said you can have 6 threads over the 3 CPU cores, but I don't think it will bring more reward than a true optimization of shaders in order to make GPU do all the hard work. But XNA point was to make things easier. Trying to make things done by GPU shaders draws that back away. It will be complex to learn and master.

About PS3, the lack of access to RSX is quite a problem... No real opportunity to tune something great. So, I think PS3 is less interesting than XNA for now. It's too close to a mere PC without any specificity. But, in fact, it's a good choice for a beginner that want to stick to classics (C language, unix environment) and don't want to be annoyed by hardware-specific programming (but in that case a mere PC could eventually do the same, so it would be, then, just the pleasure to have a 2 in 1 machine : console+PC).

XNA opens a way, but it will be hard to master it for beginners. The ones who pay will have xbox360 as additional platform to play with (but no network). Without paying, if some effort is made to obtain a correct PC graphic card the platform xp+xna may reveal itself interesting and a competitor to ps3 & xbox360.

The question is...
Is it possible to optimize GPU shaders in some unified way for PC graphic cards (with xp+xna) as far as it would be possible for xbox360 gpu?
Is xna acting as some abstraction layer (or direct3d) but in a way allowing really great optimizations?
I think there are things to study there and may be fishy stuff to dig out. That is, depending on the graphic card installed in a PC, things may be different when it comes to optimize a shader.
On the contrary if it's really possible to make all GPUs (for example ALL pixel shader 2.0 compliant graphic cards and the xbox360 GPU) work really hard in a very optimized way, then a really new friendly homebrew platform is born (mainly xp+xna because of club cost).
And maybe, the winner is not xbox360 over ps3, but xp+xna over xbox360 & ps3... (in that last case)

For xbmc users, however, they will have to stick to xbox1. At the moment it's the best and cheapest platform because it has been wide opened and codecs built in i386 world have been transported (not ported). With shaders, maybe these codecs may be ported but is it really a worthy effort (grab sources, licenses, port to shaders, etc... looks like a quite insane work, surely long to do...)?
However, with time, xbox1 will vanish since no longer manufactured. It's just a matter of time.
There is an opening there for a new i386 based machine that could fit near tv quietly and run xbmc.

(I will try to make xbox1 platform even better, soon, for openxdk developers... I try to hurry.
 Maybe, I will have some ideas about how to build up a silent os-less pc in order to replace xbox1.
 But the first step is to really master GPUs at lowest level. I'm working on it, hard. For those looking for xbmc and claiming they don't care about 3D, be aware that to reach some high video quality, GPU is needed, for antialiasing for example. It's, somehow, linked together. So we all need the true GPU power.)
Logged
Pages: 1 [2]