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Author Topic: Man Gets Pc Media Apps Running On 360  (Read 168 times)

yngwie001

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Man Gets Pc Media Apps Running On 360
« on: November 28, 2005, 04:04:51 AM »


Sorry if this is in the wrong cat.

Just been reading this,what do you guys think of it?

http://www.planetxbo...cle&article=572




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OcnewB

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Man Gets Pc Media Apps Running On 360
« Reply #1 on: November 28, 2005, 04:34:34 AM »


Sorry if this is in the wrong cat.

Just been reading this,what do you guys think of it?

http://www.planetxbo...cle&article=572


Well its not running ON the xbox. its running on the mc pc. Its like using VNC or Remote desktop but via your xbox.
It is interestimng though. But has nothing to do with hacks.




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lordvader129

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Man Gets Pc Media Apps Running On 360
« Reply #2 on: November 28, 2005, 09:07:36 AM »


theres little if any hacking potential there, since the apps are being executed on the MC PC, not the 360




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PedrosPad

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Man Gets Pc Media Apps Running On 360
« Reply #3 on: November 28, 2005, 09:25:55 AM »


Well its not running ON the xbox. its running on the mc pc. Its like using VNC or Remote desktop but via your xbox.
It is interestimng though. But has nothing to do with hacks.


Hmmmm.  See the PC-based VNC post "vulnerability found in VNC-based products".

Sending the X360 spoofed MC screen traffic may be interesting.




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SilentWatcher

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Man Gets Pc Media Apps Running On 360
« Reply #4 on: November 28, 2005, 03:15:13 PM »


This may be a way to stream different file formats to the 360 though- anyone try running a media player?

Also, there is obviously some code being executed on the Xbox itself, since the games crash- it is not simply showing the PC display on the 360.




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erikk

  • Guest
Man Gets Pc Media Apps Running On 360
« Reply #5 on: December 10, 2005, 11:50:35 AM »


sounds good...

but i cant understand one thing.

i have only a mac and emulate windows media center on virtual pc...
on the "pc" media center start but its very very slow, the transitions and rotating spin approx. 1 fps.
when i watch a wmv file it really stocks.

so now come the best:
when i connect my xbox360 with the media center on virtual pc... the menu and all will be great, its fast, no stocks...
when i watch a wmv it dont stock too. Amazing!

so i think that the xbox will calculate all graphics and videos with there own cpu and graphic card.

sorry my english is bad.

is it good?




Edited by erikk, 10 December 2005 - 08:51 PM.


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Tp21

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Man Gets Pc Media Apps Running On 360
« Reply #6 on: December 10, 2005, 02:25:26 PM »


maybe, the program IS run on the 360 after all!
we just didn't knew it!
if so, we can exploit it!




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SilentWatcher

  • Guest
Man Gets Pc Media Apps Running On 360
« Reply #7 on: December 10, 2005, 04:12:08 PM »


Some parts of the program are obviously running on the 360, and any Media Center Extender- I have been saying this all along.
This is why it cannot play DiVx- the WMV/MPEG codecs are built into the 360. Also, look the running processes on your PC when using extender functionality- for example, when browsing the web, iexplore.exe is not running on your computer- there is a version of IE6 running on the extender. This is also why some PC games that are made to run in Media Center will crash when you try to use them from an extender.

There is still no avenue to exploit it though- and I am sure all extender code is running in a sandbox or protected environment.




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sentinel0

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Man Gets Pc Media Apps Running On 360
« Reply #8 on: December 10, 2005, 09:09:09 PM »


i'm pretty sure this is old news and was explained indpet in another thread




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InterestedHacker

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Man Gets Pc Media Apps Running On 360
« Reply #9 on: December 11, 2005, 01:46:25 AM »


Some parts of the program are obviously running on the 360, and any Media Center Extender- I have been saying this all along.
This is why it cannot play DiVx- the WMV/MPEG codecs are built into the 360. Also, look the running processes on your PC when using extender functionality- for example, when browsing the web, iexplore.exe is not running on your computer- there is a version of IE6 running on the extender. This is also why some PC games that are made to run in Media Center will crash when you try to use them from an extender.

There is still no avenue to exploit it though- and I am sure all extender code is running in a sandbox or protected environment.


I agree, let me explain a bit more, on what exactly goes on, in laymans terms, to try and help some of these people understand what's going on with MCE.

As posted above, the nearest thing to explain how it works is VNC / Remote Desktop.  I originally posted this analogy a couple of threads back, but it's not a great example.

When your MCE PC connects to the XBOX360, it is given a set of interfaces that your PC can use.  This interface allows very basic communication between your PC and your XBOX 360.  Things like (and this is simplified) get file x, get file y, tell me what the application form looks like.  So, the XBOX 360 can see the WMA, WMV files on your PC.  When you play one of these files, the XBOX360 is very carefully checking the interface instructions, checking for overflows and hacks, and in the background Hypervisor is also being a bad ass and checking that the CPU isn't going AWOL with rogue code etc.

So the first possibility, of overflowing / modifying the communication interface is pretty much not going to happen.   The second part of this is video and audio streaming, when you play a movie or sound file, to get good quality playback on the XBOX360, or any other MCE device for that matter, instead of your PC playing the file (using divx etc) the file itself is streamed from your PC, in chunks, directly to the XBOX360, where it's checked, re-checked, and decoded in real time to display it.  This is why there is only support for certain file types, namely WMA, WMV etc.

There's a million to one chance that someone might be able to cause somekind of overflow error and inject some code, but that's assuming that it can get past the soft routines for checks / decryption / decoding, as well as the hypervisor and any other protections we don't know about.

I am assuming, if it's like any other windows version, that you would need to find someway of installing the codec into the XBOX360.  Considering no one has an understanding of the kernel, the MCE code on the box, or the existing codecs that are already installed, it's unlikely that someone will just be able to quickly install a new codec.

Interms of games and 'front end interfaces for programs', these are hosted through an extender, as you said.  All this is, is the graphical representation of what your PC would present to you, ie. the xbox copies the front end of the application (button positions, screen layout etc), in it's own code, which is of course checked and monitored by hypervisor all the while.  This extender app simply allows you to control the remote application on your PC.  This is why some games crash, because they were never intended to have their interface drawn on another computer.  It affects the API calls and timing of messages in the original app running on the PC, so you will get problems with apps that haven't been 'optimized' for MCE use.

As for the comment earlier about VNC exploits...  Just because VNC has exploits, doesn't mean MCE will have.  BUT, I am 100% sure there will be bugs in the MCE interface, in the decompressor code, BUT MS wouldn't needed to have worried about this, because of hypervisor and other overflow checking techniques that they learnt from the original XBOX.

And, I never even mentioned that code has to be signed to run, and I am guessing that the codec would need to be signed.




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